NOT SURE WHAT HAPPENED UP THERE^^^ Sorry
Question and am not looking for a fight. For you, if you were to use undocumented immigrants, it it cheaper to hire them and are they more available than documented or American labor. Those skilled workers in the Northeast, were they Unionized? I know some guys in the Trades who worked their way up through laborer to journeyman because of the schools that the Unions started. I also remember the Tech Schools where half the day you went to school and other half you attended vo-tech. What does your starting pay look like?
Bob
I know you are a good person, your comments will never be taken in the wrong light and I appreciate your time
I can only speak to my personal experience
I moved to this area about 10 years ago
Where I came from our labor was very skilled and tradesmen took pride in their respective craft
Knowledge was passed from old to young so skills were being passed down
The way the system works around here is nothing like the system up north
For example
In NJ we (my wife and I) had a construction company and a millwork shop
Lets focus on the millwork shop
Where I was located there was a trade school 20 minutes north of us and another 20 minutes south (we were right on the coast)
The kids would go to school for 2 hours in the AM and then get bussed to our shop
Our program (which had to be approved by the school) was to put 1 student with 1 carpenter
This student helped that carpenter for 2 semesters (about 5 months)
Every week we would give that student another tool. First week a tool box, next week a hammer, etc
It was great for everyone involved. The carpenters in our shop were older gentlemen that didn't work in the field much anymore, they were able to teach a kid that wanted to learn and the kid got to learn at a slower pace with real world hands on experience.
It was cool to see the bond between each set of guys.
If the student had an attitude or was lazy we didn't accept him anymore
It was great for me because I paid 1/3 of his salary, the school paid 1/3, and the state paid 1/3
If the kid was a good worker and he liked us he would stay for 2-3 years and then when he was done school we would hire him full time
This area would benefit greatly from this scenario
Now lets look at this area
There are very few American tradesmen locally
Take a kid getting out of high school
He can come to work for a contractor and work out in the sun all day and take home about $1k a week or he can set up beach chairs or be a waiter or some other tourist job for a little bit better money and not have to work as hard and maybe stay in the AC most of the day
That being said the kid usually chooses the easier path
Now fast forward 10-15 years and that same kid is making about the same money and has not developed skills that are worth more to the free market
That person is now stuck where they started
Now in direct response to your comment
When I first moved here the illegals made a little less then a comparable American for the same work
Now I would say they make the same if not more
It is way easier to find illegals willing to work as opposed to Americans
Up north a lot of guys are unionized but the unions aren't all they are cracked up to be
Guys left due to a lack of work, expensive dues, not much room for advancement.
We would get union guys sometimes but I tended to stay away from them because they were usually a headache and they were very set in their ways
Pay in our company varies based on our perceived value
We are set up a little different then most local builders due to our background
Up north we only build 2 homes a year but they were big homes (7500 sqft and up) and we did the majority of the work in house
Here most of the builder are construction managers (meaning they don't put on the tools and do field work)
It was hard for me to try to transition to the way most builders work here
We have 2 supervisors that oversee and work on their projects
We have 3 carpenters, 2 skilled helpers, and 4 laborers
Our 2 working supers make over $100 per year and are great (I brought them down from up north)
Our carpenter make around $36/hr
Our skilled helper make around $29/hr
Our laborers make around $25/hr (a little less if they don't know english yet)
We try to treat our good guys like family and they appreciate it
As an outsider that loves the area I would love to see the following as far as construction goes
-trades schools for kids that want to go into our line of work
-english lesson for the illegals that want to learn
-access to work visas so the illegals aren't so scared all the time
You ain't from around here are ya boy? 
