Don't ask, Don't tell

[Matt J]

"that lovely stereotype that just because someone is gay they are/want to have sex with anyone of the same sex".. so if I'm male, straight, but I assure the powers that be that I don't want to have sex with 99% of the women I'm around, I should be allowed to shower with the women at the local health club? Apparently equal treatment is not enough?

I'm all for mandatory mutual sex health club bathrooms and showers, assuming we all agree that's ok.

It's nice to see that when cornered you resort to 5th grade argumentative logic.

 

[30ashopper]

It's nice to see that when cornered you resort to 5th grade argumentative logic.

It's nice to see when cornered you're incapable of defending your position.

 

[Matt J]

It's nice to see when cornered you're incapable of defending your position.

Part of being a winner is knowing when enough is enough. Sometimes you have to give up the fight and walk away, and move on to something that's more productive.

 

[30ashopper]

Part of being a winner is knowing when enough is enough. Sometimes you have to give up the fight and walk away, and move on to something that's more productive.

Well I just have to say, I'm jealous. By your standards, as a straight male in the military, I should be given the privilege of living closely among those that I sought after sexually, and no one would have a right to complain.

That's sounds ok really, my hope would be that men & women would be treated equally across the board. People who took advantage of that situation would be punished, but those that didn't would be left alone.

So I guess we are in the same boat, you want equal treatment for all, and I do to. I just wish I could go back to being a college student once and if it happens.

 

[LuciferSam]

Well I just have to say, I'm jealous. By your standards, as a straight male in the military, I should be given the privilege of living closely among those that I sought after sexually, and no one would have a right to complain.

That's sounds ok really, my hope would be that men & women would be treated equally across the board. People who took advantage of that situation would be punished, but those that didn't would be left alone.

So I guess we are in the same boat, you want equal treatment for all, and I do to. I just wish I could go back to being a college student once and if it happens.

There are a lot of differences. One of them is that the likelihood of mutual attraction plays into this. I dont' seek sexually those that aren't likely to return the "favor" or whatever you might want to call it. I wouldn't go around hitting on lesbians. It's a waste of my time and on top of that they might kick my ass.

 

[ASH]

I really don't understand what all the fuss is about - there have always been gay men and women serving in our armed services (about 65,000 currently). All they are asking is to not be discharged/fired solely for being gay.

To go back to the original post, I have a question. If a gay person is not supposed to tell and nobody has the right to ask, how would you know that there are about 65,000 gays in the military? Maybe the real number is only 10,000....Maybe the real number is 125,000.

It would seem to me that the idea of attempting to count this group is asking to open a huge can of worms.

 

[Teresa]

I really don't understand what all the fuss is about - there have always been gay men and women serving in our armed services (about 65,000 currently). All they are asking is to not be discharged/fired solely for being gay.

To go back to the original post, I have a question. If a gay person is not supposed to tell and nobody has the right to ask, how would you know that there are about 65,000 gays in the military? Maybe the real number is only 10,000....Maybe the real number is 125,000.

It would seem to me that the idea of attempting to count this group is asking to open a huge can of worms.

good point ash. and a can of worms it surely will be. but it seems to me that it has to be opened eventually. why not now? Don't Ask Don't Tell seems like a terribly wrong, dishonest way to operate. But at the time it was one solution that allowed gays to continue to serve as long as they remained quiet. It may have been the best they were going to get at the time. But, its really not good enough. It is just a way of putting off the inevitable - at some point its going to be time to open the can and deal with it - the question is - are we ready?

 

[ASH]

Allow me to put my spin on this and hopefully we'll get the other side as well.
I'm straight. I wouldn't have problems with daily activities of the military alongside a gay soldier.
It would get weird if someone took an interest in me. They would find out immediately that I'm not an available person, no big deal.
What would become weird would be going to the showers at the locker room with this particular person after this. I would think they were looking at me in a different manner than I believe should be allowed.

From a government perspective, what do you do about this? Give gays their own shower. No. I would imagine there are gay people who don't want other gay people looking at them in a manner they don't approve of. Is this really any different than having male and female showers?

 

[GoodWitch58]

maybe it's time for a bit more privacy for everyone in the showers/locker-rooms what do health clubs and gyms do?

 

[30ashopper]

maybe it's time for a bit more privacy for everyone in the showers/locker-rooms what do health clubs and gyms do?

That might be the simplest solution, but probably very costly - isolate everyone on base in areas where privacy must be respected.

If Obama we're smart, he'd kick something like that off right now, the number of construction jobs it would generate would probably be quite large.