Welcome to America

[James Bentwood]

Bob
I know you are a good person, your comments will never be taken in the wrong light and I appreciate your time
I can only speak to my personal experience
I moved to this area about 10 years ago
Where I came from our labor was very skilled and tradesmen took pride in their respective craft
Knowledge was passed from old to young so skills were being passed down
The way the system works around here is nothing like the system up north

For example
In NJ we (my wife and I) had a construction company and a millwork shop
Lets focus on the millwork shop
Where I was located there was a trade school 20 minutes north of us and another 20 minutes south (we were right on the coast)
The kids would go to school for 2 hours in the AM and then get bussed to our shop
Our program (which had to be approved by the school) was to put 1 student with 1 carpenter
This student helped that carpenter for 2 semesters (about 5 months)
Every week we would give that student another tool. First week a tool box, next week a hammer, etc
It was great for everyone involved. The carpenters in our shop were older gentlemen that didn't work in the field much anymore, they were able to teach a kid that wanted to learn and the kid got to learn at a slower pace with real world hands on experience.
It was cool to see the bond between each set of guys.
If the student had an attitude or was lazy we didn't accept him anymore
It was great for me because I paid 1/3 of his salary, the school paid 1/3, and the state paid 1/3
If the kid was a good worker and he liked us he would stay for 2-3 years and then when he was done school we would hire him full time
This area would benefit greatly from this scenario

Now lets look at this area
There are very few American tradesmen locally
Take a kid getting out of high school
He can come to work for a contractor and work out in the sun all day and take home about $1k a week or he can set up beach chairs or be a waiter or some other tourist job for a little bit better money and not have to work as hard and maybe stay in the AC most of the day
That being said the kid usually chooses the easier path
Now fast forward 10-15 years and that same kid is making about the same money and has not developed skills that are worth more to the free market
That person is now stuck where they started

Now in direct response to your comment
When I first moved here the illegals made a little less then a comparable American for the same work
Now I would say they make the same if not more
It is way easier to find illegals willing to work as opposed to Americans
Up north a lot of guys are unionized but the unions aren't all they are cracked up to be
Guys left due to a lack of work, expensive dues, not much room for advancement.
We would get union guys sometimes but I tended to stay away from them because they were usually a headache and they were very set in their ways

Pay in our company varies based on our perceived value
We are set up a little different then most local builders due to our background
Up north we only build 2 homes a year but they were big homes (7500 sqft and up) and we did the majority of the work in house
Here most of the builder are construction managers (meaning they don't put on the tools and do field work)
It was hard for me to try to transition to the way most builders work here
We have 2 supervisors that oversee and work on their projects
We have 3 carpenters, 2 skilled helpers, and 4 laborers
Our 2 working supers make over $100 per year and are great (I brought them down from up north)
Our carpenter make around $36/hr
Our skilled helper make around $29/hr
Our laborers make around $25/hr (a little less if they don't know english yet)

We try to treat our good guys like family and they appreciate it

As an outsider that loves the area I would love to see the following as far as construction goes
-trades schools for kids that want to go into our line of work
-english lesson for the illegals that want to learn
-access to work visas so the illegals aren't so scared all the time

Interesting post - the situation you left sounds like a good model for young people, like European system that gives them a real opportunity to make a life without the need for higher education in the academic setting like University.

I'm curious if you regret moving your business here and if you're life is better, business harder, income opportunity better ... would you tell your past self to hold up moving?

 

[PoppaJ]

I'm not following your comment
If the government forced people to stay home and then gave the employers money to pay those people that closes the loop
You want to know if its fair for the people that stayed home and didn't get paid
Were they employees?

Personally as an employer we were not allowed (or supposed to be allowed) to submit for PPP money

For example in my company
We have an office staff of 3 plus me
We submitted to be reimbursed for paying a percentage (I cannot remmeber the percentage) of the 3 employees missed time at work, I was not allowed to submit for my time (but I didn't really miss work so I shouldn't of either way)
Our field guys were never missed any time

Not sure how my student loan logic ties in

Ask or comment if you care for a response

I’ve never seen a pretzel as twisted as this post.

 

[PoppaJ]

This is a lot of words to say so little but lets break it down

Its funny to see you twist the term alpha the way you do

I cannot speak for anyone but me but when I speak about 'alpha' males I am not speaking about a 'leader of the pack' person like you have pigeon holed your response

Lets change my term 'alpha' to 'real men'
By real men I do not mean male, I mean people that do the right thing, live right, stand up for whats right, protect the innocent or weak, etc.
These are the kind of people you call when there is a problem or when something needs to be done or handled
To say 'alphas' have a less respectful attitude towards women says more about the writer then the person being wrote about
Real men have mothers, sisters, daugters, grandmothers, wives, and women they care about (some of them are women) and people who care about these women would never let anyone disrespect them. Period
Anyone that treats a woman (or anyone for that matter) as less then is not a alpha at all

I would go on but no one is going to change you view so I wish you the best

Aspiring alpha male manslpaining

 

[Teresa]

Aspiring alpha male manslpaining

Mansplainer splains all about real men.
Gotta love it.
Move over Joshy.

 

[PoppaJ]

Then why not open your own insurance company?
You wouldn't even need to take a salary if you didn't want to to keep rates as low as possible
Its very very simple, people will open business's if they can make money
If companies are leaving its because it is not worth it

Why not have a governor who addresses the problem?
You trumpers had no problem pointing the finger at Biden every time a corporation raised the price on an item you never used in the first place so where is the DeSantis finger pointing?

 

[PoppaJ]

Mansplainer splains all about real men.
Gotta love it.
Move over Josh.

View attachment 101229

 

[PoppaJ]

It is interesting that you would not know what a living wage is. Living wage = (Cost of living expense including taxes) + (15%) is an oversimplified formula. So if you were honest you would admit that illegal immigrants have less cost of living and pay less taxes which lowers the income they are willing to work for. Further if you were honest you would admit that you prefer not to train a college graduate (trust me they are willing to work for a living wage) because they cost more and have an education such that they know if they are being taken advantage of. Just be honest about it is all.

I don't "back" either political party. I back accountability.

Yes you hurt people. You refuse to take accountability for it which is worse. You would rather justify some political spin rather than take responsibility for your words (your words is all I have to go on). Spreading false information hurts people, spreading covid around by not taking any precautions whatsoever hurts people and purposely, grouping people into categories that you can hate hurts people. If you can read you would know that the vaccine helps lower the risks for serious health consequences and lowers the risk of spreading it to another human but you would rather justify a political position. In my book you hurt people purposely.

Full time employment should lift you out of poverty not keep you in it.

 

[Lou Deman]

Why not have a governor who addresses the problem?
You trumpers had no problem pointing the finger at Biden every time a corporation raised the price on an item you never used in the first place so where is the DeSantis finger pointing?

You like the kool aide

 

[PoppaJ]

You like the kool aide

 

[Lou Deman]

It is interesting that you would not know what a living wage is. Living wage = (Cost of living expense including taxes) + (15%) is an oversimplified formula. So if you were honest you would admit that illegal immigrants have less cost of living and pay less taxes which lowers the income they are willing to work for. Further if you were honest you would admit that you prefer not to train a college graduate (trust me they are willing to work for a living wage) because they cost more and have an education such that they know if they are being taken advantage of. Just be honest about it is all.

I don't "back" either political party. I back accountability.

Yes you hurt people. You refuse to take accountability for it which is worse. You would rather justify some political spin rather than take responsibility for your words (your words is all I have to go on). Spreading false information hurts people, spreading covid around by not taking any precautions whatsoever hurts people and purposely, grouping people into categories that you can hate hurts people. If you can read you would know that the vaccine helps lower the risks for serious health consequences and lowers the risk of spreading it to another human but you would rather justify a political position. In my book you hurt people purposely.

Don't dodge the question
How much money is a living wage, in your honest opinion? Lets get to a dollar amount not post some generic equation
What makes you think an illegal pays less in taxes in your honest opinion?
What makes you think their cost of living is less, in your honest opinion?
Do you pay your people for the task they are performing based on their skill level or do you pay people based on their personal situation?
You find me a college graduate that is willing to work in the construction field and I will pay you $5k on their 1 year mark, if they don't make it 1 month you pay me, does that sound fair?
Do you honestly think a college degree makes someone aware that they are being taken advantage of?
I would love to teach a few young people how to make money but none want to play the long game or put in the work (generally speaking)

I know you are politically right down the middle, as long as the middle means the middle of the left

Who do you think spread covid more, the vaccinated or the unvaccinated?
Why did you get vaccinated?
Do you believe the vaccine helped you? What proof do you have for your answer? Were you ever really at risk? If you weren't at risk would you have taken it?

My choice to not take the vaccine had nothing to do with politics and everything to do with education