13,000 protest Governor's plan to change collective bargaining for public employees

[poppy]

Corporations use profits stolen from shareholders to fund their favorite politicians....
Unions use dues stolen from members to fund their favorite politicians.
Two sides of the same coin, both are equally wrong. Both are damaging to our country.

Love your logic, Unions fight every day for the average worker to recieve a fair wage and safe working conditions while corporations use shareholder profits fight against the same. Things are not equal.

 

[30ashopper]

Love your logic, Unions fight every day for the average worker to recieve a fair wage and safe working conditions while corporations use shareholder profits fight against the same. Things are not equal.

Unions serve a valid purpose, but they can also abuse their power, just like company management. The whole goal is balance. In the case of civil service unions, inbalance can easily form because the money spent on employees is funded by the bottomless pit of tax payer dollars.

 

[poppy]

Unions serve a valid purpose, but they can also abuse their power, just like company management. The whole goal is balance. In the case of civil service unions, inbalance can easily form because the money spent on employees is funded by the bottomless pit of tax payer dollars.

Except the taxpayers elect to public office or appoint their own overseers to protect themselves from such abuse of power, not the case with for-profit Corporations where the President of the company will appoint the Chairman of an overpaid but in their pocket "Board of Directors" who will in many cases will sell out the shareholders.

 

[30ashopper]

Bernie Nikolay should be happy. His school district - he's the superintendent in Milton - had a good November.

The girls swim team won the state title, a first for Milton girls athletics. And an arbitrator said the district could switch health coverage away from the insurer owned by the teachers union. That'll save the district as much as a million bucks a year.

For a district with a $33 million budget, that's cheery. For the rest of the state, it means a tide may have turned.

It could mean the end to the costly market dominance of WEA Trust, the health insurer owned by the Wisconsin Education Association Council. Just under two-thirds of Wisconsin districts use WEA Trust, a puzzling preference since its coverage is so costly.

Districts that buy WEA Trust plans average $1,665 a month for family premiums, according to their state association, while those choosing other carriers average $1,466. The difference is greatest where taxpayers cover the whole premium.

Milton was paying $48,301 more in premiums for every month that it couldn't switch from WEA Trust to a pair of plans from Madison-based Dean Health and Janesville-based MercyCare that it said were comparable. The district already had switched its administrative staff, said Nikolay, and while the union objected that the new plans would restrict choices, most teachers already used doctors at Dean or MercyCare clinics, Nikolay noted. "That made it less problematic for a lot of our families."
And it saved a bundle for a district saddled with "bleak local economic conditions," as its arbitration case put it. It is losing students and, thus, state aid. The area is losing population. The district needed to control premiums, and the arbitrator agreed.

The question is why it had to go to arbitration at all. The answer is that in Wisconsin, school districts can't change health carriers - even if they keep benefits the same - without negotiating. And teachers unions have been very partial to keeping WEA Trust.

..

The school boards association favors excluding the choice of health carrier from bargaining. That leaves the benefits themselves negotiable, just not a preference for the union's company. Such a change ought to be swift business for the next Legislature.

How Milton schools saved a bundle - of your money - JSOnline

Very very swift.

 

[Andy A]

What a great post! 30ashopper, you are to be commended for your research and the results they produce. As I've said previously, my research days are past as I know longer enjoy it as I once did. You, once again, are to be congratulated.

 

[scooterbug44]

Great example of why some of these reforms are needed - especially around the teacher's union!

Ridiculous that they had to get insurance from the company owned by the union!

I believe Dean Health (which they switched to) is the provider for most other state employees and many businesses - the poor teachers now have a Cadillac plan instead of a Rolls Royce plan.

 

[idlewind]

I think the difference between this and the filibustering is that there is a very real purpose to the current protests and the walkout by the state senators. The is a very real perceived threat of immediate harm to the livelihoods of the state workers, and they are justifiably taking action. The senators, who happen to agree with their stance, are making the correct moral decision. Fleeing the state is their only legal means.

On the other hand, the Republican filibustering was nothing more than politically motivated obstructionism. The WI protests emanate from some very real issues at the grass-roots level, while the party of "No" sillyblustering was just an attempt to weaken the Democratic party. In conjunction with a number of scare tactics, they were successful judging by the midterm results. I don' think their tactics are going to help them much where it really counts, which is the 2012 Presidential election. On that count, I think their efforts will have proven to be a failure. I can't grasp why they think continuously trying to vilify the middle class in possible swing states is going to help them.

Obstructionism and moral decisions are in the eye of the beholder. IMHO you should reverse parties in your comment and you would have it right.

 

[GoodWitch58]

This is the most reasonable and intelligent piece on Unions and government that I have seen. http://www.nytimes.com/2011/02/28/opinion/28mayor.html

To the extent that collective bargaining agreements or state laws are no longer serving the public, we should change them. That is what democracy is all about ? and that is our responsibility. The job of labor leaders is to get the best deal for their members. The job of elected officials is to get the best deal for all citizens.

Rather than declare war on unions, we should demand a new deal with them ? one that reflects today?s economic realities and workplace conditions, not those of a century ago. If we fail to do that, the fault is not in our unions, or in our stars, but in ourselves.

 

[scooterbug44]

Talked to a relative from WI last night and got an earful - among the items mentioned: the teachers have domestic partnership benefits (this is a straight person thing), so they do not have to be married or common law to have them on their health insurance (at no cost to them BTW).

And despite all the wrangling and supposed compromises from the unions, it is not being backed up in reality. Janesville's teachers just renewed their contract for 2 years - with no changes to their pension or insurance. (No idea why the school board agreed.)

 

[30ashopper]

?This is going to get passed and people will sit back and say, ?What happened?? ? said Mark Horton, a retired firefighter who is treasurer of the Ohio Association of Professional Firefighters. ?Once it?s done, there?s no putting the genie back in the bottle.?

Unlike similar legislation in Wisconsin, which exempts police officers and firefighters, the Ohio bill includes them, making the measure particularly contentious. The bill is expected to be taken up by the Ohio Senate as soon as Thursday.

But Republicans say legislation that seeks to eliminate long-held union prerogatives are part of broader austerity measures intended to reduce crippling budget deficits, of which public employee pensions have played a growing role.

Mr. Horton said rhetoric suggesting that union members were overpaid and pampered was unfair.

?The upper class has done a great job of pitting the middle class against itself,? he said. ?I get a pension of $3,700 a month. If someone thinks I?m riding high on the hog, that?s just not the case.?

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/03/02/us/02states.html

3700/month = 45K a year, for life, after retirement at 55. What alternate universe do these people live in? That's living "high on the hog" in my book, especially if you include other benefits like social security and medicare.