Illegal Immigration

[Geo]

Shopper,
you are using emotional talking points. People don't come here for free healthcare- they could get that in many of the countries they are leaving. And they don't come here to kill people. They come here for an opportunity to work hard and be productive members of a free society.

I have met many immigrants in my travels to 43 states. They all fell into 2 categories:

-hard working poor who took on the jobs that no one else here really wanted

-hard working entrepreneur types who started out working in jobs that no one wanted, saved, started a business and navigated into and past the middle class

The fact of the matter is that the majority of the welfare cases of whom you speak are white people born here.

Latinos and Canadians don't try to come here to kill people, to get food stamps or to get healthcare.

 

[30ashopper]

Shopper,
you are using emotional talking points. People don't come here for free healthcare- they could get that in many of the countries they are leaving. And they don't come here to kill people. They come here for an opportunity to work hard and be productive members of a free society.

I have met many immigrants in my travels to 43 states. They all fell into 2 categories:

-hard working poor who took on the jobs that no one else here really wanted

-hard working entrepreneur types who started out working in jobs that no one wanted, saved, started a business and navigated into and past the middle class

The fact of the matter is that the majority of the welfare cases of whom you speak are white people born here.

Latinos and Canadians don't try to come here to kill people, to get food stamps or to get healthcare.

You're arguing against human nature and real statistics my friend, that's an argument you're going to lose. European immigration policy serves as proof positive of the theory. If you want to ignore this, feel free, but you'll be doing the country a disservice in doing so. I will not be ignoring it, because it's a real issue.

 

[Minnie]

This is a situation not unlike the off shore drilling concerns for this area. Those that live here and visit frequently are very concerned about the effects off shore drilling. Those that don't live here or even visit, are not so concerned. You have to live it sometimes to know the effects and concerns.

Same with illegal immigrants. Until you have been affected by the gangs, the crime such as hit and run DUIs, the affect on the local school system, the local ERs, the total disregard to local ordiances such as occupany for a single family dwelling, taxes are the least of the problems in our area.

I think changes need to be made, not sure this new legistation is the way to do it, I think the businesses that willingly employ illegals are a serious concern and I do think there needs to be changes to the system for becoming legal.

And Yes there are always exceptions, I have met some that are here to try to work and get a better life. But many were criminals in Mexico and now are criminals here.

Now we have Latino gangs fighting with other gangs and innocent children being killed in drive by shootings.

 

[Linda]

This is a situation not unlike the off shore drilling concerns for this area. Those that live here and visit frequently are very concerned about the effects off shore drilling. Those that don't live here or even visit, are not so concerned. You have to live it sometimes to know the effects and concerns.

Same with illegal immigrants. Until you have been affected by the gangs, the crime such as hit and run DUIs, the affect on the local school system, the local ERs, the total disregard to local ordiances such as occupany for a single family dwelling, taxes are the least of the problems in our area.

I think changes need to be made, not sure this new legistation is the way to do it, I think the businesses that willingly employ illegals are a serious concern and I do think there needs to be chances to the system for becoming legal.

I agree - Seems to me that just by cracking down on the employers who hire the illegals we would take care of a big part of the problem. No job = no money = no reason to come in the first place. I keep wondering if my simplistic mind is missing something

I also agree about having to live something in order to know the effects and concerns. I have a friend that got transferred to Phoenix because of her husband's job. She literally lived in fear for 2 years before they were able to get back to Kentucky. She will never go back.

 

[scooterbug44]

Are criminals/gangs there because illegal immigrants are there, or because of drugs?

I know that it is a growing problem, but I don't know the real causes of the problem. I do know that "illegals" get blamed for a lot of things they don't necessarily do.

I would certainly support stepping up enforcement, changes to immigration law, AND immediately and permanently deporting anyone convicted of a major/violent crime.

As far as occupancies, my grandparents raised a family of 9 in a house the size of many Sowal vacation home great rooms or garages, so much of it is perspective.

 

[Geo]

Shopper,

Here's the rub. I could present to you statistics and outcomes that show that a single payer healthcare system works in European countries. I could share with you statistics and data that prove a minimum drinking age is useless and that marijuana can be legalized and taxed (just to name a few) with positive outcomes under a European model.

And odds are you would ignore these and say what is true there is not automatically true here because too many variables aren't factored in.

So it shouldn't be foreign to you that I don't weigh Freidman's *opinion* heavier than either of ours.

The generalizations about human nature and telling me that my disagreement with you and Friedman on this issue is a disservice to our country- well, that's not like you.

 

[Em]

Arizona has passed legislation making it a crime to be an illegal immigrant and requiring police to check the immigration status of anyone they suspect is an illegal alien.

Hope they've got a lot of extra money in the budget for jails and lawsuits.

How about they just stop anyone who looks like they may not have a driver's license or auto insurance? Does this give officers the ability to "legally" stop anyone for looking like an illegal immigrant, while really searching for drugs?

This has to be unconstitutional. Illegal immigrants come in all shapes, colors, and nationalities.

 

[Minnie]

Are criminals/gangs there because illegal immigrants are there, or because of drugs?

I know that it is a growing problem, but I don't know the real causes of the problem. I do know that "illegals" get blamed for a lot of things they don't necessarily do.

I would certainly support stepping up enforcement, changes to immigration law, AND immediately and permanently deporting anyone convicted of a major/violent crime.

As far as occupancies, my grandparents raised a family of 9 in a house the size of many Sowal vacation home great rooms or garages, so much of it is perspective.

The majority of Latino gang members here were in gangs in Mexico and have simply relocated. They have however recruited other illegals that were not criminals before coming here because right now the housing market which most worked in has declined and they need money. Actually in Memphis, drugs is not as much a problem with some of the illegals as stolen property, especially vehicles, unless they are in a gang. Also the gang leaders promise protection for newly arrived illegals and supply them with fake IDs, and Driver's licenses and even Social Security cards. It becomes very tempting for someone that is here illegaly with no friends or support system, no job and no credidentials to turn to these gangs as a type of family.

Scooter, your grandparents raised a family of 9, not housed 9 adult males with 9 vehicles in a house with three bedrooms and parking for 2 or maybe 3 cars, there is a difference.

We live in a very diverse area of Memphis. We have a wonderful Vietnamese family next door that has 5 children but again only two cars.

We have a wonderful back yard Afro-American family with 6 kids but again only two adults and two cars.

A very sweet couple from the Dominican Republic that is becoming legal citizens with one car and 4 children and several well behaved dogs.

And we have a 3 bedroom house down the street with 9 adult Latinos, with 9 cars and then on weekends their friends which swells to about 20 cars and extremely loud partying, drugs and public drunkeness with shooting of guns and pit bulls that run lose and kill any animal it meets.

We know these are illegals because at times the police have actually caught them doing drugs and arrested a few. Only for those few to be replaced very quickly with some new arrivals.

I have lived here in this same spot for over 28 years and I am not going to move out because of them. That does not solve the problem it simply means we gave in and ran away.

 

[LuciferSam]

Shopper,
you are using emotional talking points. People don't come here for free healthcare- they could get that in many of the countries they are leaving. And they don't come here to kill people. They come here for an opportunity to work hard and be productive members of a free society.

I have met many immigrants in my travels to 43 states. They all fell into 2 categories:

-hard working poor who took on the jobs that no one else here really wanted

-hard working entrepreneur types who started out working in jobs that no one wanted, saved, started a business and navigated into and past the middle class

The fact of the matter is that the majority of the welfare cases of whom you speak are white people born here.

Latinos and Canadians don't try to come here to kill people, to get food stamps or to get healthcare.

When an illegal does happen to kill somebody either intentionally or accidently, a big fallacy arises that "if only we properly enforced our immigration laws, this never would have happened." Sure it would, it happens all the time with legal residents. You don't stop murder or DUI manslaughter by going after illegals, you do it by going after killers and drunk drivers. Illegal aliens, jaywalkers, murderers, shoplifters, drunk driving are all law enforcement issues. Law enforcement with its limited resources should place priority on the most serious issues. In and of itself, illegal immigration is not one of them. Busting illegals for loitering is going to do nothing to bring down the rate of violent crime. If resources are available, then fine, go after the petty criminals.

 

[GoodWitch58]

...and if the companies and corporations hiring the undocumented workers were fined and stopped; then, the number of people coming here through illegal means would certainly be affected.