Religion in schools

[BeachSiO2]

Interestingly enough, the concept of the bible as a literal instead of symbolic document really only goes back to the 19th century.

That's not what the Bible says! lol

I usually stay away from these threads, but wanted to comment on this one part and throw in my opinion. The early Christians believed that the bible had many different levels of understanding, with literal being one of those levels. Since it is much easier to tell us (I include myself) what to do and how to act, the literal level of understanding (and close offshoots) has been chosen by many mainstream religious groups as the only way. It has led to a further reliance on corporate religion where you worship the church you attend and the practices (Epsicopalian here ) trying to show how my group is better than your group, more than how we are all in communion with God.

One other note, the Christian tradition typically goes through a major reformation on the order of every five hundred years and guess what, it's coming around that time now. In case anyone cares, one term that has been coined is the emergent church and there is a large amount of information on the web.

 

[Rita]

" Questioning does not necessarily mean ignoring...but it does mean thinking about what you are about to do and examining whether or not that is the proper course to follow for you.

I would prefer to have someone: a child, a co-worker, a friend --think about an issue and discuss it with respect; than just have follow an "authority" figure simply because of the role that person fills.

IMO there is a huge difference in blinding following authority and having no manners, no social skills, no respect for parents, teachers, etc. And, I also believe that to be respected, one must show respect. " - Goodwich

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This is also how we try to raise our daughter. We don't mind her questioning authority in a thoughtful and respectful way. And there have been plenty of times she has been right to question. Sometimes things don't go her way even when she probably was right, but that is when the need to accept that old saying that life isn't always fair comes into play. You move on.

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[GoodWitch58]

thanks, Rita. I have lots of fond memories of times I learned so much from my son because he questioned what I was saying/doing...I am so grateful that I was able to open my mind to see his point of view, and learn a new approach in the process.

Today, we share much laughter and kidding as we remember some of these times....

 

[Lynnie]

I was taught, "Don't discuss, politics, money or religion at the supper table." LOL

This, way before cyber communications and message boards.

All amazingly great, intelligent points in this thread. What impresses me most is the passion in which each person presents themselves/beliefs. Please don't ever lose sight of your passion.....it's a huge part of who you are!!

Cheers~~~~~~~~

 

[GoodWitch58]

I was taught, "Don't discuss, politics, money or religion at the supper table." LOL

This, way before cyber communications and message boards.

All amazingly great, intelligent points in this thread. What impresses me most is the passion in which each person presents themselves/beliefs. Please don't ever lose sight of your passion.....it's a huge part of who you are!!

Cheers~~~~~~~~

I know what you mean--but, thank goodness, my parents encouraged livily discussions at the dinner table, and while my Mom often became frustrated with the four of us, my dad was a real sport -- especially about politics and religion.

We didn't have much money, so that was not often a subject.

Now, my Mom is 92 and once a month we all get together to have lunch with her; she still gets a bit miffed with my brothers and me and our "arguments"....all the grand kids and even the great grandkids get into the act though...and we learn a lot!

I, too, appreciate the information and passion that people bring to the Board.

 

[ShallowsNole]

goodwitch, et al,

Thank you for your response. I should just give it up, now that everybody has an insight into our family dynamic (didn't I warn about what most folks in NE Walton believe about religion in school three pages ago, before my spouse came in behind me and proved it? He prefers to sit back and watch but somebody struck a nerve.)

In reference to questioning authority, I am more specifically referring to teenagers/tweenagers, specific rules of school or society that the child knows about beforehand. (I know I included young adults before; I am reducing my sample.) Teachers, principals, law enforcement officers, and the judge. Obviously anybody has the right to remain silent, but don't do it with a smirk on your face, and for goodness sakes, don't curse a principal, a police officer, or the judge. Yes, it happens, and it is by kids that Fuzz and I have seen grow up.

Of course, not all adults have authority. That's how a lot of crimes against children happen.

And when you grow up, sometimes you have to ask questions. But by then, most adults know when it's appropriate to ask, and when it's best to shut up. Those who don't find out pretty quickly.

 

[Bob]

It taught me that when my parents said jump, they meant JUMP. Not later, not after negotiating it, NOW.

"Time Out" and loss of privileges was useless in 1960's Walton County, as there was nothing to do and you had no privileges anyway.

As for kids that are taught to question authority...that just makes me sad.

"internally" question authority equals think for yourself and learn to recognize hypocrisy. beating/intimidating kids is the easy way out for a frustrated adult.

 

[Lynnie]

I know what you mean--but, thank goodness, my parents encouraged livily discussions at the dinner table, and while my Mom often became frustrated with the four of us, my dad was a real sport -- especially about politics and religion.

We didn't have much money, so that was not often a subject.

Now, my Mom is 92 and once a month we all get together to have lunch with her; she still gets a bit miffed with my brothers and me and our "arguments"....all the grand kids and even the great grandkids get into the act though...and we learn a lot!

I, too, appreciate the information and passion that people bring to the Board.

Sounds funn.....we still get into it, too. My Mother stated, "How can so many children come out of me and not be in agreement and be so different!"

Pretty cool, isn't it???

;-)

 

[LuciferSam]

Ahhh....fresh horses.

O.K.-First off, I'm not here to convert anybody, let's be clear on that! But I do believe that having "no religion" is a cop-out. Having a belief in one entity or another has been the norm for thousands of years. Suddenly, all you "learned" folks want to wipe religion out, starting with the children, which is how any new way of thought is accomplished. May take a generation or two.

Norm doesn't mean correct, right, wrong, proper, improper, accurate, innaccurate, moral, immoral. It's more a matter of acceptability which again does not pertain to rightness. In some communities it was once acceptable to hold lotteries for public stonings. It was the norm. You are correct on the count that as man has learned more about the universe phenomena once attributed to the mystical have acquired a more material or secular explanation. You don't see epileptics undergoing exorcisms anymore, although maybe in some circles in Walton County the notion is entertained.

Since we're getting way off topic here (religion in schools), let me try to package my point and present it to you.....

It would probably best at this point to keep all religion out of the schools, for your sakes, even though some of the larger universities, not to mention america, was built based on religion.

But - all religion must be kept out! This includes evolution, etc. Any historic belief that can't be obviously proven be an unbiased majority (past or present). Keep any "ideas" or "psychologies" out of the curriculum. Keep it to literacy, problem solving, and skill building. Don't even mention religious choice in school.

That way we can all raise our children based on our personal beliefs or religions, or let them have free rein if that's how you want to raise them.

If you're going to teach "millions and billions of years ago" in school, that is religion-and it undermines the teaching of our "family" religions at the home.

It looks like you just want to expand the scope of religion to include anything that irrefutably renders your beliefs obsolete.

 

[woodworker]

Norm doesn't mean correct, right, wrong, proper, improper, accurate, innaccurate, moral, immoral. It's more a matter of acceptability which again does not pertain to rightness. In some communities it was once acceptable to hold lotteries for public stonings. It was the norm. You are correct on the count that as man has learned more about the universe phenomena once attributed to the mystical have acquired a more material or secular explanation. You don't see epileptics undergoing exorcisms anymore, although maybe in some circles in Walton County the notion is entertained.

Yeah, I don't find any teachings on public stonings and such in my Bible. This is why I only refer to the written Word for answers. Enter man, with his sin and lust, and the word quickly gets twisted (example - mandatory water baptism, "new wine", so on). Nowadays we can easily see the inaccuracies in our fore fathers Christian ideals, but lately I believe many new twists and hypocrisies are occuring that may not be questioned for generations.



(you're quote) - It looks like you just want to expand the scope of religion to include anything that irrefutably renders your beliefs obsolete.[/quote]


You're using the term "irrefutably" pretty loosely here, aren't you?