Scott scraps Orlando to Tampa rail project

[BeachSiO2]

Let me see if I am following correctly:

Bad - accepting federal money to build a high speed train system in an area that has been preparing its infrastructure for it

Because future usage is uncertain and there are big capital outlays.

Good - spending $$$ to deepen a port

Even though it hinges on a foreign project that isn't complete, future usage is uncertain, and there are big capital outlays.

Good Gravy .

For the ports and shipping industry, which is still the number 1 way we receive imports, losing the Panamax battle cannot be understated. While I completely support the use of alternative transportation, we are talking apples and oranges when comparing economic impact this time. Talk about a Race to the Top, these port upgrades are of immense economic benefit to not only the state but the region and the nation. This is not speculation and the ports have to move quickly to be ready. Also, the ports have been preparing for these projects just like the high speed rail groups have been preparing for their projects.

What's missing is that they are two COMPLETELY different pots of money- highway, surface transportation monies vs Corps of Engineers money. I know some will say it's still our money/federal money. My point is that the monies come from different appropriations bills so they don't directly compete. Congress and the Administration can deem both of national significance and fund them separately.

 

[30ashopper]

Florida lawmakers have one week to cobble together a complicated deal that would give the $2.4 billion Gov. Rick Scott rejected Wednesday to another entity, such as Amtrak. But it would require approval of Scott, Sen. Bill Nelson just announced. "Right now, time is our enemy," he said. Members of Florida's congressional delegation met with U.S. Transportation Secretary Ray LaHood, who outlined the deal Thursday afternoon. LaHood left without comment but was visibly rattled by Scott's move.

Why don't they take that 2.4 billion and put it toward paying down the $1,600,000,000,000.00 federal deficit this year? These idiots must think money grows on trees.

 

[GoodWitch58]

Scott’s high-speed imprudence - Editorials - MiamiHerald.com

Why would Gov. Rick Scott just say no to $2 billion in federal funding for a bullet train already approved by that the GOP-led Legislature ? a project that would create thousands of jobs for Florida?

Many people are asking that question after the governor canceled plans for a high-speed train line between Tampa and Orlando, which eventually would extend to Miami?s intermodal center near the airport. Many of those caught by surprise, in fact, are from the governor?s own party.

State Sen. Paula Dockery, an early supporter of Mr. Scott?s ?Let?s get to work? campaign, noted, ?It would be more prudent? for him to allow private companies to bid for the project and show how they would pay operating costs and any cost overruns before turning down the deal. As it is, she told the Herald/Times Tallahassee Bureau, there are seven teams from 11 countries ready to compete to build and run the bullet train.

Ms. Dockery is right. It was imprudent for the governor to unilaterally turn down an initial $300 million in federal stimulus dollars already appropriated by the Legislature ? in fact, he has no constitutional authority to do so. Florida Senate Budget Committee Chair J.D. Alexander and Senate Transportation Committee Chair Jack Latvala wondered as much, too.

This is a case of the governor putting his ideology before common sense ? even if it means turning down 14,000 jobs and eventually as many as 25,000 by the time the Miami leg would be completed.

Mr. Scott says the project would put Florida taxpayers at risk because of potential cost overruns and that ridership figures are too rosy. Those are good reasons to question the project?s viability ? except U.S. Transportation Secretary Ray LaHood and Chairman Mica worked hard in bipartisan fashion to ensure that Florida would not risk a penny because private companies bidding on the project would assume all cost overruns and operating expenses.

Read more: http://www.miamiherald.com/2011/02/17/2071609/scotts-high-speed-imprudence.html#ixzz1EG9ONVA7

I think this will get really interesting before it's over...

 

[GoodWitch58]

it just got more interesting:

Scott rebuked by 26 senators over high-speed rail funding - Political Currents - MiamiHerald.com

A veto-proof majority of the Florida Senate tells federal officials to give Florida $2.4 billion in bullet train money, even though Gov. Rick Scott wants to reject it


Read more: http://www.miamiherald.com/2011/02/17/2072075/scott-rebuked-by-26-senators-over.html#ixzz1EGB0WHoE

 

[beachmouse]

The Florida Senate has enough votes to override any Scott attempts to kill the high speed rail project. It's gonna get really interesting if the House follows suit:

Veto-proof majority of Senate rebukes Rick Scott over high-speed rail | Florida politics blog: The Buzz | tampabay.com & St. Petersburg Times

Another interesting bit from Senate budget chief JD Alexander:

JD: Dear Gov., I think you broke the law | Florida politics blog: The Buzz | tampabay.com & St. Petersburg Times

 

[30ashopper]

Scott’s high-speed imprudence - Editorials - MiamiHerald.com

Why would Gov. Rick Scott just say no to $2 billion in federal funding for a bullet train already approved by that the GOP-led Legislature ? a project that would create thousands of jobs for Florida?

Many people are asking that question after the governor canceled plans for a high-speed train line between Tampa and Orlando, which eventually would extend to Miami?s intermodal center near the airport. Many of those caught by surprise, in fact, are from the governor?s own party.


I think this will get really interesting before it's over...

That guarantee there's no risk is completely bogus. The state can't prevent a business from walking away. The same thing has been tried on various other projects and in the end, taxpayers end up picking up the tab.

And no matter what an overly-optimistic company might agree to,if its special-purpose entity for Florida high-speed rail got in seriously over its head and walked away from the project after spending, say $3 billion (including the feds? $2.4 billion), what options would the state then have? With no way of repaying thefeds? money?now turned into concrete and steel?it would have nochoice but to spend state tax money finishing the project and then subsidizing its operations.

Florida Gov. Scott Rejects Flawed Orlando to Tampa High-Speed Rail Plan - Hit & Run : Reason Magazine

A team led by Oxford University Professor Bent Flyvbjerg studied more than 258 infrastructure megaprojects across the world and found passenger-rail systems experience cost overruns of 45 percent on average. If the current Tampa-Orlando cost estimate is off by that average ? 45 percent ? the project would need an additional $1.2 billion.

..

Just as worrisome: These types of large rail projects don't just cost more than expected to build; they cost more to operate. Flyvbjerg's research finds: "There is a massive and highly significant problem with inflated forecasts for rail projects. For two-thirds of the projects, [ridership] forecasts are overestimated by more than two-thirds."

2 views on high-speed rail | Derail it: Taxpayers would be on the hook - Orlando Sentinel

 

[AlphaCrab]

The Florida Senate has enough votes to override any Scott attempts to kill the high speed rail project. It's gonna get really interesting if the House follows suit:

Veto-proof majority of Senate rebukes Rick Scott over high-speed rail | Florida politics blog: The Buzz | tampabay.com & St. Petersburg Times

Another interesting bit from Senate budget chief JD Alexander:

JD: Dear Gov., I think you broke the law | Florida politics blog: The Buzz | tampabay.com & St. Petersburg Times

Best news I have hear all day-Let's rise up people, we now have a Mubarek on our hands here in Fla. The people of Florida have the power, not this disdainful corporate felon!

 

[scooterbug44]

I must be dreaming - an actual political discussion about actual rules and procedures and the good of the state coming before political affiliations.

 

[beachmouse]

We're all just kind of jointly watching Governor Scott learn the kinds of basic civics lessons that he was supposed to have picked up on in middle school.

The St. Pete's Times 'Dear Mr. Governor- you can't run the state as a CEO' article is now looking oddly prophetic.

 

[GoodWitch58]

...and it is getting curiouser and curiouser....

J.D. Alexander Questions Plane Sale | TheLedger.com

A top Senate Republican, J.D. Alexander, R-Lake Wales, told the governor in a letter Thursday that he may have broken state law by his push to sell two state planes used to ferry his predecessors and other elected officials across the state.

The letter came one day after Gov. Rick Scott angered and disappointed both Republicans and Democrats in the Legislature with his decision to reject $2.4 billion in federal aid to build a high-speed rail line between Orlando and Tampa.