Tax on a taxpaying Government worker

[Bob Wells]

Try this one, I was told today by Representative Matt Gatez and Senator Don Gatez that the house bill on retirement charging 3% of a Government employees wages who are in the Florida Retirement System won't be going to the Florida Retirement system as Representative Coley believes, but will be placed into the general revnue fund to offset the deficit. This is essentially a tax on a single group of taxpayers, Government employees. Isn't that fair.

 

[Bob Wells]

Oh, the cost of State government on average is $65 per person, Florida is less than $40 per person. Still a bargain.

 

[idlewind]

Try this one, I was told today by Representative Matt Gatez and Senator Don Gatez that the house bill on retirement charging 3% of a Government employees wages who are in the Florida Retirement System won't be going to the Florida Retirement system as Representative Coley believes, but will be placed into the general revnue fund to offset the deficit. This is essentially a tax on a single group of taxpayers, Government employees. Isn't that fair.

Why would anyone think it was appropriate to charge an employee a pecentage of their salary for retirement and then place the funds into the government general fund instead of the person's retirement account? Oh wait, I know where Scott got the idea----the Social Security Administration.

Seriously, that sounds to me like a huge ripoff of the employees.

 

[Bob Wells]

Well obviously, the Tea Party contingient and Govenor Scott and the Republican Legislators are selective about who should be taxed. If you are going to go after the employees who are in FRS and you are calling it pension reform, then at least put the money toward the pension and not the general fund. If the Pension is in such bad shape then that is where the money should go, but as Representative Matt Gaetz advised the State needs the money. The first step towards a State Wide INCOME TAX is being tries out on GOVERNMENT EMPLOYEES. That's a 3% of each employees paycheck.

 

[idlewind]

Well obviously, the Tea Party contingient and Govenor Scott and the Republican Legislators are selective about who should be taxed. If you are going to go after the employees who are in FRS and you are calling it pension reform, then at least put the money toward the pension and not the general fund. If the Pension is in such bad shape then that is where the money should go, but as Representative Matt Gaetz advised the State needs the money. The first step towards a State Wide INCOME TAX is being tries out on GOVERNMENT EMPLOYEES. That's a 3% of each employees paycheck.

This is not tea party policy IMHO. The tea party is against increased taxes for anyone and is certainly opposed to a state income tax. Scott has his own agenda here.

 

[30ashopper]

Try this one, I was told today by Representative Matt Gatez and Senator Don Gatez that the house bill on retirement charging 3% of a Government employees wages who are in the Florida Retirement System won't be going to the Florida Retirement system as Representative Coley believes, but will be placed into the general revnue fund to offset the deficit. This is essentially a tax on a single group of taxpayers, Government employees. Isn't that fair.

From what I understand of the system, every year the state takes general revenue from tax collections and transfers it into the pension system. This transfer takes up about 12% of general revenue. The money is either invested or is used to pay current pension benefits. So I don't believe what you were told is correct. The state is always in the process of transferring some amount of money (probably on a monthly or bi-weekly basis) into FRS. According to the SBA, about 65% of paid benefits come from investment, the rest come directly from the taxpayer's wallets.

The Funds We Manage

 

[30ashopper]

Well obviously, the Tea Party contingient and Govenor Scott and the Republican Legislators are selective about who should be taxed. If you are going to go after the employees who are in FRS and you are calling it pension reform, then at least put the money toward the pension and not the general fund. If the Pension is in such bad shape then that is where the money should go, but as Representative Matt Gaetz advised the State needs the money. The first step towards a State Wide INCOME TAX is being tries out on GOVERNMENT EMPLOYEES. That's a 3% of each employees paycheck.

All this really amounts to is a 3% pay cut for state workers with the savings transferred into FRS to pay for current retiree benefits. It's not a state income tax, it's a state payroll tax on public employees. (just like social security is at the federal level.)

Speaking of which, do state of Florida defined benefit beneficiaries pay social security? I know in some states they don't pay ss and they don't collect it either. I've never understood how that works.

 

[Bob Wells]

All this really amounts to is a 3% pay cut for state workers with the savings transferred into FRS to pay for current retiree benefits. It's not a state income tax, it's a state payroll tax on public employees. (just like social security is at the federal level.)

Speaking of which, do state of Florida defined benefit beneficiaries pay social security? I know in some states they don't pay ss and they don't collect it either. I've never understood how that works.

I believe they do pay SS. Also this tax on employees, it does not go into the FRS but into the General Fund per Reprensentative Matt Gaetz and Senator Don Gaetz. Rep Matt Gaetz said the reason it is going to the general fund is and I quote "we need the money". As an aside I noticed both of them support this initiative and not one Tea Party individual has come out against the tax on government workers in the FRS. Where is the HUE and CRY.

 

[Bob Wells]

All this really amounts to is a 3% pay cut for state workers with the savings transferred into FRS to pay for current retiree benefits. It's not a state income tax, it's a state payroll tax on public employees. (just like social security is at the federal level.)

Speaking of which, do state of Florida defined benefit beneficiaries pay social security? I know in some states they don't pay ss and they don't collect it either. I've never understood how that works.

Spin it any way you want, a class of citizens are paying a tax no one else is paying. The money is being used to finance the general fund deficit. I would have less issue with it if it was going into the FRS because then they recieve benefit, but going into the general operating account it benefits evryone and as I said 1 class of people are paying for it.

 

[30ashopper]

I believe they do pay SS. Also this tax on employees, it does not go into the FRS but into the General Fund per Reprensentative Matt Gaetz and Senator Don Gaetz. Rep Matt Gaetz said the reason it is going to the general fund is and I quote "we need the money". As an aside I noticed both of them support this initiative and not one Tea Party individual has come out against the tax on government workers in the FRS. Where is the HUE and CRY.

Just curious, do you pay social security?

It's true this will end up in the general fund. Prior to the law FRS payments are made from the general fund to pay benefits and increase investment. From the general fund employees of the state are also paid. After the law passes a small percentage that would have gone to paychecks now stays in the general fund. That money can be used for anything. To figure out if it's going to FRS, we would have to compare FRS payments between budgets to see if the funds are in fact being transfered over to FRS. I'd love to know if that's the case once the budget is published. If they don't transfer the money over, they aren't improving the financial stability of the FRS system. Sort of like Washington spending social security surpus on other things - kicking the problem down the road.

Either way it's a pay cut to you, there's no getting around that. You would have received the benefits no matter what.