Watch This, Global Climate Change Content

[Teresa]

Global warming is an interesting topic of discussion for me. Some folks get really "heated" when they defend their position that global warming exists, but I doubt that many have any clue of the facts. Further, it is amazing to me that Al Gore is now a leading expert on Climatology... how did that happen?

I recall back at Georgia Tech in the early 90's, global warming was a topic of discussion. This is not a new subject, so why all the renewed interest? I recall one of my professors teaching that global warming was a joke. In fact, we all seem to forget that in the 70's, global cooling was the greatest threat to our planet. Why do we allow ourselves to be manipulated by politicians and fear-mongers?

Carbon Dioxide accounts for less than 3/10's of one percent of the gases in the atmosphere. The most liberal of experts claim that humans cause roughly 20% of that amount. Why would the earth be so fragile that such a minute amount of CO2 would be cause for alarm? It is clear to me that the sun is the major cause of warming and cooling, not CO2. Evidently, folks don't understand this fact.

As far as the religious arguments against global warming... no one needs to go there when you have concrete facts that discount the argument. Religious leaders have adamantly supported "truths" that turned out to be false in time. Remember the belief by the early Christian Church that the Earth was the center of the universe, Heaven above, Hell beneath? The Sun rotated around the Earth? When Galileo pointed his telescope toward the Heavens, he saw something that brought him directly into conflict with the Church. In fact, it is very possible that the Pope at that time had his eyes put out...

My bet is that global warming as an issue will die in the next ten years. The problem is, another issue will take its place...

Little Fish

Thank goodness world leaders, including the pope-meister, have come to embrace science and its significance to mankind's understanding and even continued existence. people do learn from their mistakes from one century to the next, ya know. and this is what the "sudden" interest in climate and global warming is all about (we've heard about global warming for years now. leaders and people are just starting to listen). our industrial civilization has weilded widespread and potentially permanent damage to our environment, and continue to do so each and every second of the day. do people just not get that? come on, its right in front of your closed eyes!open them for once and for all, it is really not very difficult.
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November 1, 1992
Vatican Science Panel Told By Pope: Galileo Was Right
Moving formally to rectify a wrong, Pope John Paul II acknowledged in a speech today that the Roman Catholic Church had erred in condemning Galileo 359 years ago for asserting that the Earth revolves around the Sun.

The address by the Pope before the Pontifical Academy of Sciences closed a 13-year investigation into the Church's condemnation of Galileo in 1633, one of history's most notorious conflicts between faith and science. Galileo was forced to recant his scientific findings to avoid being burned at the stake and spent the remaining eight years of his life under house arrest.

John Paul said the theologians who condemned Galileo did not recognize the formal distinction between the Bible and its interpretation.

"This led them unduly to transpose into the realm of the doctrine of the faith, a question which in fact pertained to scientific investigation.

Though the Pope acknowledged that the Church had done Galileo a wrong, he said the 17th-century theologians were working with the knowledge available to them at the time.

 

[30A Skunkape]

Before anyone comes to the conclusion that the Pope has hopped on the global catastrophe bandwagon, please read this. He is 100% correct on the issue. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/li...in_article_id=501316&in_page_id=1811&ito=1490

 

[John R]

 

[Teresa]

Before anyone comes to the conclusion that the Pope has hopped on the global catastrophe bandwagon, please read this. He is 100% correct on the issue. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/li...in_article_id=501316&in_page_id=1811&ito=1490

I knew you would pull this out of your hat at some point. the title of this article is so misleading. The Pope condemns the climate change prophets of doom (give me a break).

the pope, in his infinite (and well-informed) wisdom, is 100% correct in his statements. but he does not refute global warming. he wisely advises world leaders that we need to proceed carefully and as a world community, with a reasonable plan, etc. (he knows he's asking the impossible with some world leaders - including current US administration)...


excerpt from Pope Ben's World Peace Day comments, last year:

The German-born Pontiff said that while some concerns may be valid it was vital that the international community based its policies on science rather than the dogma of the environmentalist movement.


"It is important for assessments in this regard to be carried out prudently, in dialogue with experts and people of wisdom, uninhibited by ideological pressure to draw hasty conclusions, and above all with the aim of reaching agreement on a model of sustainable development capable of ensuring the well-being of all while respecting environmental balances.
"If the protection of the environment involves costs, they should be justly distributed, taking due account of the different levels of development of various countries and the need for solidarity with future generations.

"Prudence does not mean failing to accept responsibilities and postponing decisions; it means being committed to making joint decisions after pondering responsibly the road to be taken."
Efforts to protect the environment should seek "agreement on a model of sustainable development capable of ensuring the well-being of all while respecting environmental balances", the Pope said. He added that to further the cause of world peace it was sensible for nations to "choose the path of dialogue rather than the path of unilateral decisions" in how to cooperate responsibly on conserving the planet.


brilliant! I wish Benadict was running for President.

 

[Little Fish]

Tootsie:

I didn't suggest that people don't change; rather, that they do change when proven wrong. Change rarely comes overnight so why allow oneself to get caught up in theories which will be replaced in time. Your post regarding John Paul is really no surprise to me... it took the Church 360 years to acknowledge they were wrong. How many other "truths" are wrong? If The Holy See can get something wrong, surely Al Gore et al. can get something wrong.

If you are interested in learning about the speed and nature of scientific progress, I recommend you read the book "The Structure of Scientific Revolutions" by Thomas Kuhn. When you're done, please come back and tell us whether you still feel fired up about Global Warming... or any other theory for that matter.

Little Fish

 

[John R]

If you are interested in learning about the speed and nature of scientific progress, I recommend you read the book "The Structure of Scientific Revolutions" by Thomas Kuhn. When you're done, please come back and tell us whether you still feel fired up about Global Warming... or any other theory for that matter.

Little Fish

is it ok if one is concerned and active about a cause without reading the referenced book?

 

[full time]

I noticed in the debate last night a comment that the US has not issued a nuclear power permit in 30 years and that nuclear power accounts for only 20% of the nation's energy needs, soon to drop to 15%. It occurs to me that the same people here who moan and groan about global warming, foreign oil dependency, obscene profits for the oil companies, drilling in Alaska, etc., etc., etc., are the same folks who will be up in arms when the U.S. grants a new permit for a nuclear power plant. God help us if we were to put that plant in the same scrub pine forest as the new airport. The Natural Resources Defense Council and the Defenders of Wildlife would have a collective stroke. Get the protest posters (and sunscreen) ready. It's gonna be HOT out there.

 

[Little Fish]

John R:

"is it ok if one is concerned and active about a cause without reading the referenced book?"

Thanks for making me smile.

Little Fish

 

[Teresa]

Tootsie:

I didn't suggest that people don't change; rather, that they do change when proven wrong. Change rarely comes overnight so why allow oneself to get caught up in theories which will be replaced in time. Your post regarding John Paul is really no surprise to me... it took the Church 360 years to acknowledge they were wrong. How many other "truths" are wrong? If The Holy See can get something wrong, surely Al Gore et al. can get something wrong.

If you are interested in learning about the speed and nature of scientific progress, I recommend you read the book "The Structure of Scientific Revolutions" by Thomas Kuhn. When you're done, please come back and tell us whether you still feel fired up about Global Warming... or any other theory for that matter.

Little Fish

I appreciate your thoughts on this little fish. 360 years it took for the church to "officially" make a statement on galileo. that's about average in the ancient, slow moving catholic church! nothing new there. (I'm sure you realize that this change in church view on science took place hundreds of years ago, just never got around to making an official statement about this. gee, I wish other big organizations were not afraid of saying "we were wrong.").

I am not really interested in reading about the speed and nature of scientific progress. I leave it to all of you who enjoy science. But, I do understand that scientific progress takes forever and a day. its an extraordinary endeavor. As long as they continue their work, I'm happy. Scientists must not be swayed by politics or religion. They will find the right answer. But, environmentalists aren't always willing to wait 300 years for the final answer. sometimes you really must make a leap of faith based on the evidence before you and make your best guess, before its too late for action. as you must know.

It's not an easy issue, and my guess it never shall be. should we just sit on it for a while? nah.

 

[John R]

The Holy See can appear quite contrary:

http://www.planktos.com/Newsroom/VaticanbecomesWorldsFirstCarbonNeutralSovereignState.html



San Francisco -- July 12, 2007 -- By agreement with the Vatican, Planktos/KlimaFa is now pleased and honored to announce that the Vatican plans to become the world's first entirely carbon neutral sovereign state, and it has accepted KlimaFa ecorestoration offsets to achieve this historic goal. In a brief ceremony on July 5th the Vatican declared that it had gratefully accepted KlimaFa's offer to create a new Vatican Climate Forest in Europe that will initially offset all of the Vatican City State's CO2 emissions for this year.

His Most Reverend Eminence Cardinal Paul Poupard presided at the event and stated, ?As President of the Pontifical Council of Culture; I am honored to receive this donation from the leaders of Planktos-Klimafa. This donation means an entire section of a national park in central Europe will be reforested. In this way, the Vatican will do its small part in contributing to the elimination of polluting emissions from CO2 which is threatening the survival of this planet.



"As the Holy Father, Pope Benedict XVI, had recently stated, the international community needs to respect and encourage a ?Green Culture,? characterized by ethical values. The Book of Genesis tells us of a beginning in which God placed man as guardian over the earth to make it fruitful. When man forgets that he is a faithful servant of this earth, it becomes a desert that threatens the survival of all creation?"

Pope Benedict XVI's inspiring guidance strongly reinforces an increasing Vatican environmental concern articulated by Pope John Paul II in his 2001 Blueprint for the New Millennium, "How can we remain indifferent to the prospect of an ecological crisis which is making vast areas of our planet uninhabitable and hostile to humanity?" Cardinal Renato Raffaele Martino, head of the Pontifical Council of Justice and Peace, reaffirmed this warning at Vatican Conference on Climate Change and Development this April, "For environment ... read Creation? Man must cultivate and safeguard God's Creation."

According to Planktos CEO and KlimaFa Managing Director, Russ George, "the Holy See's increasingly creative environmental leadership is both insightful and profound. Not only is the Vatican steadily reducing its carbon footprint with energy efficiency and solar power, its choice of new mixed growth forests to offset the balance of its emissions shows a deep commitment to planetary stewardship as well. It eloquently makes the point that ecorestoration is a fitting climate change solution for a culture of life."

Dr. David Gazdag, KlimaFa's Managing Director in Budapest, added, "We believe this Climate Forest initiative clearly reflects the Vatican's deep commitment to both environmental healing and the welfare of the poor. Besides their local ecological and global climatic benefits, these projects offer many rewarding new eco-forestry jobs to struggling rural communities and increasing eco-tourism employment opportunities as these beautiful woodlands mature."

The new Vatican Climate Forest will be created in Hungary's B?kk National Park under the auspices of the KlimaFa Climate Parks program. Its dimensions will be determined by the Vatican?s 2007 energy usage and the success of its current emission reduction efforts. KlimaFa has received EU JI Track 1 approval to plant thousands of hectares of new native species, mixed growth forests under the permanent protection of European national park systems. Its initial projects are being conducted in collaboration with Hungary's government, Academy of Sciences and National Parks Directorate.

Planktos/KlimaFa has further committed to work with the Vatican and the Pontifical Council of Culture to develop methods to calculate the CO2 emissions of individual Catholic churches and offer ecorestoration options to turn their carbon footprints green.