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Why are you a Conservative, Liberal, Socialist, Communist, Centrist etc..

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I am not putting the blame on every man-made disaster on greed. I am putting the blame for this oil spill on greed. Many reports have come out that many subcontractors doing work on Deepwater Horizon were firmly in favor of shutting the rig down for safety concerns, but the Company Man from BP demanded that they continue the cementing operations. The reason was that the operation of the rig was costing BP $500,000 per day. I have heard reports that BP makes in the neighborhood of 68 million dollars per day in profits. If they can't pay 500K out of their profits to insure that this rig was operated safely, then that is greed. As a footnote, the chief drillmaster of the rig was one off the people that argued strenuouly with the BP man to shut down the rig, and he was one of the men killed in the explosion. Now please tell me how enviornmental extremists had anything to do with this oil spill.
I am talking about the general attitude and response of environmental extremist to ANY situation with which they disagree, not just the present tragedy in the gulf. Do you or any one of your obvious belief ever really read what someone with a different point of view writes? From your response to my last post, it would not appear so, but then why am I not surprised. Also, please note I am referring to extremists, not environmentalists of which, in the normal realm of events, I consider myself one. Additionally, I do not have one bit of sympathy or support for BP or our government in this incident. If you drill where you cannot possibly reach the wellhead you have to be stupid beyond reproach, IMHO, but then in fairness, I am not a petroleum engineer.
 
I am doing this for a school project and think it may be fun to do here on Sowal.

I'll start:

I'm a Republican because:
  • ...
  • I believe that every child has a constitutional right to an equal education granted by the government...
  • I also believe that non-U.S. citizen enemies of freedom around the world should have no constitutional and limited human rights....
[/LIST]
Your turn...

Perhaps you need to dust off those US Gov't school books, or better yet, just grab a copy of the US Constitution. Then, after reading the Constitution, please share with us the part about equal education granted by the gov't. After that, please find the part in the Constitution which says you have to be a US citizen to have Constitutional rights while in the USA.

By the way, not only are those not in the Constitution, they are not part of the Republican platform. Maybe your report should be on why people are not learning about our Founding Documents in school. ;-)
 
I am talking about the general attitude and response of environmental extremist to ANY situation with which they disagree, not just the present tragedy in the gulf. Do you or any one of your obvious belief ever really read what someone with a different point of view writes? From your response to my last post, it would not appear so, but then why am I not surprised. Also, please note I am referring to extremists, not environmentalists of which, in the normal realm of events, I consider myself one. Additionally, I do not have one bit of sympathy or support for BP or our government in this incident. If you drill where you cannot possibly reach the wellhead you have to be stupid beyond reproach, IMHO, but then in fairness, I am not a petroleum engineer.

Andy: I don't have any quarrell with you. Sarahwind stated that "leftist enviornmentalists were responsible for this oil spill". Vitually all of my energy has been devoted to finding out how anyone can make such an insulting statement with no facts to bear this out. This oil spill is like nothing else that has happened. I'm quite sure that enviormentalists can go to extremes, yet I'd just as soon side with them as the extremists who decided to drill 5,000 feet below the Gulf of Mexico without adequate drill casing and no functional blow-out protector. The enviormentalists, whether their methods are extreme or not, are trying to protect us all from our own insane poison.
 
what does it say about an individual who would rant about environmentalists in the face of an unprecedented oil spill.
 
Perhaps you need to dust off those US Gov't school books, or better yet, just grab a copy of the US Constitution. Then, after reading the Constitution, please share with us the part about equal education granted by the gov't.

"The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people."

That's a little something called the 10th Amendment. Education was not guaranteed in the constitution because it was left to the individual states. Massachusetts had compulsory education in the 1600's and it eventually spread to every state.

I would argue that since every state has compulsory education and every state is held to the 14th amendment, that that means every child has a guaranteed right to equal education guaranteed by the law. If you have a way of arguing against that I would be interested in hearing it.



After that, please find the part in the Constitution which says you have to be a US citizen to have Constitutional rights while in the USA.

Nowhere does it say that, and I never said it did. The constitution is supposed to be the supreme law of the land. But the drafters of the document recognized that they cannot predict the future. Which is why they allowed the constitution to be amended.

The "Founding Fathers" were politicians, and that only. They were some of the greatest political minds ever to live on this planet. But they were human and they were definitely not God. Do you really think the founding fathers predicted everything that was going to happen in the future? Could they have known about the ways the international economies of the world would be connected in the future and how immigration would affect us.

Our government throughout history has gone beyond what the constitution specifically allows, and as long as they hold to the structure of government the constitution established, I don't think the "Founding Fathers would be against it.

By the way, not only are those not in the Constitution, they are not part of the Republican platform. Maybe your report should be on why people are not learning about our Founding Documents in school. ;-)

I would say that neither party even has a unified platform on immigration currently; that is one of the reasons it's so difficult to solve.

As for education, I would hope both parties have equal education as part of their platform. I just think the Republicans have better ideas to make it happen. And I don't know what you're talking about but I was referring to school vouchers; which are definitely part of the mainstream Republican platform.
 
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By the way, not only are those not in the Constitution, they are not part of the Republican platform.

Murray, I give you The Official 2008 GOP Platform for Elementary and Secondary Education.

The first line states, "All children should have access to an excellent education that empowers them to secure their own freedom and contribute to the betterment of our society."

How does that mean, "equal education for every student guaranteed by the government", is NOT part of the republican platform???

Source:http://www.gop.com/2008Platform/Education.htm

Ouch!!
 
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Murray, I give you The Official 2008 GOP Platform for Elementary and Secondary Education.

The first line states, "All children should have access to an excellent education that empowers them to secure their own freedom and contribute to the betterment of our society."

How does that mean, "equal education for every student guaranteed by the government", is NOT part of the republican platform???

Source:http://www.gop.com/2008Platform/Education.htm

Ouch!!

Just as an off-topic aside related to the Constitution and education, I believe that further you are from a problem, the less you care about it and the less effective you are in dealing with it.

This holds especially true for education. The further you get from a school system the less you care about and the less competent you are to deal with its problems. State level educators rarely are as invested in a school systems needs and success as those at the local level. This is even more true at the Federal level, yet we cede more and more control of our education process to the Federal government.

Where in the Constitution does it in any way give the Federal government any role in education, much less in a train wreck like the "No child too far ahead" legislation?
 
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Where in the Constitution does it in any way give the Federal government any role in education, much less in a train wreck like the "No child too far ahead" legislation?

Maybe the most controversial sentence in the entire constitution at the time of ratification. The infamous "Elastic Clause" which says in Article 1 section 8 Clause 18: "The Congress shall have Power - To make all Laws which shall be necessary and proper for carrying into Execution the foregoing Powers, and all other Powers vested by this Constitution in the Government of the United States, or in any Department or Officer thereof."

This is why I believe the constitution is mostly irrelevant in the creation of laws. It controls the way government should be structured, but even that has been changed by more recent government (See direct election of senators). But the constitution is very contradictory as far as how much power the federal government has: One one side, you have the 10th amendment, which which gives the Federal government NO power beyond the original constitution, then you have the Elastic clause, which gives government all the power in the world.

So that is where the Federal government gets its role in intruding into education at a local level. It is also where government gets the right to control your health care, break up corporations, and control social security.

Even at the time the federalist and anti-federalist argued intensely over what that meant. But it is why government has been able to grow beyond what the constitution specifically allows over time. This clause was obviously the most heavily debated at times like the Hamiltonian bank and the New Deal eras.


Just as an off-topic aside related to the Constitution and education, I believe that further you are from a problem, the less you care about it and the less effective you are in dealing with it.

This holds especially true for education. The further you get from a school system the less you care about and the less competent you are to deal with its problems. State level educators rarely are as invested in a school systems needs and success as those at the local level. This is even more true at the Federal level, yet we cede more and more control of our education process to the Federal government.

Well, until George W. Bush came into office, abolishing the Department of Education has been part of the Republican platform. Reagan and the Bush 41 just didn't have the votes in congress to actually do it. I think Bush 43 helped push federal intrusion into local education a more mainstream Republican party position.

I agree with that assessment to a certain extent. With that being said, I believe the Federal Department of Education being created in 1979 can be traced back to only 4 words in the Brown decision: "with all deliberate speed."

Well, certain states decided that their "deliberate speed" was going to be "NEVER."

After 25 years of unsuccessfully trying to get the states to do something that the federal government couldn't really force them to do, the federal government decided they would intrude. The original intent of the Department of Education was to deal with civil rights and dole out federal funding for Education. Really, only since No Child Left Behind has the federal government been involved in setting standards or curricula.

Although I agree that state governments need to have more control over standards and curricula, they have been known to wildly abuse that power. The Scopes trial and the recent Texas textbook controversy have shown that federal government could be a good way to ensure that states stay as neutral as possible in their education.

The Texas textbook controversy was wildly overblown in the liberal media. But what worries me about it is that those standards that only Texas set, will be in every textbook in the country when the next set of textbooks come out. So essentially, Texas controls the curricula of the entire country.
 
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Maybe the most controversial sentence in the entire constitution at the time of ratification. The infamous "Elastic Clause" which says in Article 1 section 8 Clause 18: "The Congress shall have Power - To make all Laws which shall be necessary and proper for carrying into Execution the foregoing Powers, and all other Powers vested by this Constitution in the Government of the United States, or in any Department or Officer thereof."

This is why I believe the constitution is mostly irrelevant in the creation of laws. It controls the way government should be structured, but even that has been changed by more recent government (See direct election of senators). But the constitution is very contradictory as far as how much power the federal government has: One one side, you have the 10th amendment, which which gives the Federal government NO power beyond the original constitution, then you have the Elastic clause, which gives government all the power in the world.

So that is where the Federal government gets its role in intruding into education at a local level. It is also where government gets the right to control your health care, break up corporations, and control social security.

Even at the time the federalist and anti-federalist argued intensely over what that meant. But it is why government has been able to grow beyond what the constitution specifically allows over time. This clause was obviously the most heavily debated at times like the Hamiltonian bank and the New Deal eras.




Well, until George W. Bush came into office, abolishing the Department of Education has been part of the Republican platform. Reagan and the Bush 41 just didn't have the votes in congress to actually do it. I think Bush 43 helped push federal intrusion into local education a more mainstream Republican party position.

I agree with that assessment to a certain extent. With that being said, I believe the Federal Department of Education being created in 1979 can be traced back to only 4 words in the Brown decision: "with all deliberate speed."

Well, certain states decided that their "deliberate speed" was going to be "NEVER."

After 25 years of unsuccessfully trying to get the states to do something that the federal government couldn't really force them to do, the federal government decided they would intrude. The original intent of the Department of Education was to deal with civil rights and dole out federal funding for Education. Really, only since No Child Left Behind has the federal government been involved in setting standards or curricula.

Although I agree that state governments need to have more control over standards and curricula, they have been known to wildly abuse that power. The Scopes trial and the recent Texas textbook controversy have shown that federal government could be a good way to ensure that states stay as neutral as possible in their education.

The Texas textbook controversy was wildly overblown in the liberal media. But what worries me about it is that those standards that only Texas set, will be in every textbook in the country when the next set of textbooks come out. So essentially, Texas controls the curricula of the entire country.

Nice post.

Abolishing the Dept of Ed has always been a fool's errand. Bureaucracy's raison d'etre is really to keep their employees employed. That means that they only grow, they never shrink and departments and agencies never go away. They may morph into other departments (like they did with DHS) but they don't go away or give up power.

The lack of connection in the public's mind between the drivel candidates spout (like this) compared to what they actually do when they get in office never ceases to amaze me.
 
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